[ajstan99]

While this issue doesn't appear to be carrier-specific and RIM will be responsible for fixing, I was wondering if TMo had any timetable on when the fix would be available.

As it turns out, it was good that I called, as per two different reps, this issue had not yet reported, nor was it identified in their database as an issue to be fixed in a future release from RIM.

I'm not sure if anyone has reported this issue in the past, but, in any case, for those of you experiencing this problem (regardless of carrier) please consider calling your respective support department to hopefully raise the priority. Thanks.

[EGottlieb]

Good point -- the more pressure that the carriers get, the more pressure that they will put on RIM...

[dandmbb]

I've reported this to TMobile twice in the past. On the second call, they even called BlackBerry support. They must not have a very good tracking system.

[ajstan99]

UPDATE: I'm not hopeful about a solution anytime soon. Just received a follow-up call from a TMo support rep who wanted me to re-download and install 4.0.0.198 (which I had already tried) to try and fix the problem. Sounds like they aren't yet acknowledging that low Bluetooth volume is a known 4.x issue.

She then said that she was going to escalate this issue to "the techs who would probably get Blackberry involved." I reiterated that contacting RIM was the only way to address this issue as the problem does not seem to be limited to a single carrier/phone/4.x software version.

Again, it appears that this issue is far below the level of "yes, we know about this issue and the engineers are working on a fix as we speak."

[dandmbb]

Seems like RIM has a practice of saying they've never heard of a problem in order to avoid fixing it. In looking at these forums, i have seen many entries where people say they have reported the problem to both T-Mobile and RIM. Since the sound is much better under the old operating system, it is obviously a problem with their software "upgrade."

[jnelson2000]

As we discussed earlier, I just wanted to update you on our progress with the issues that you have reported.

These items have received quite a great deal of attention from our Technical Support, Software Development, and Hardware Engineering teams, just to name a few.

I understand that at this time you have likely returned your 7250 BlackBerry has you have stated you would, however I would like to let you know that we have communicated your concerns with call quality to various departments. It is in our plan to improve the acoustic noise in the next product release. This is part of our continuous product quality improvement plan. As well, you had noted that the call volume on the 7100 series BlackBerry is not equal to what you have noticed on our CDMA and iDEN BlackBerry Wireless Handheld, such as the 7250 and 7520. We have taken this in and are internally evaluating ways to increase the call volume on our GSM/GPRS products. Finally, you have also commented on the Bluetooth support on the BlackBerry 7520. We have updated the Bluetooth components of our latest handheld software offering for the Nextel 7520. At the present time Nextel is in the review phase and they will make this software available to customers upon the completion of this review process.

I would like to express our deep gratitude and appreciation for your feedback on our BlackBerry products. It is through this feedback that our customers continue to help us in our efforts to evolve the BlackBerry product to better meet their needs, their likes, and their wishes.

Thank you for using BlackBerry Technical Support,

[ajstan99]

Thanks for the info, jnelson. Hopefully the call volume via handset and Bluetooth are related, and will be fixed simultaneously.

I had to go back to 3.8 to get better Bluetooth headset volume. Of course, the reception is not as good and I have the "Delete On MailBox And Handheld Issue", but at least I'll be able to use the headset in the car and airport again.

[Scootdog]

I have the same problem with my 7100t. I have not used my headset since I upgraded.

There are 3 volume settings on my head set. With the 3.x version that came with my phone the volume was set to medium. Now I have it on High and can't hear as well as before. :(

[supercrackberry]

Originally Posted by jnelson2000

As we discussed earlier, I just wanted to update you on our progress with the issues that you have reported.

These items have received quite a great deal of attention from our Technical Support, Software Development, and Hardware Engineering teams, just to name a few.

I understand that at this time you have likely returned your 7250 BlackBerry has you have stated you would, however I would like to let you know that we have communicated your concerns with call quality to various departments. It is in our plan to improve the acoustic noise in the next product release. This is part of our continuous product quality improvement plan. As well, you had noted that the call volume on the 7100 series BlackBerry is not equal to what you have noticed on our CDMA and iDEN BlackBerry Wireless Handheld, such as the 7250 and 7520. We have taken this in and are internally evaluating ways to increase the call volume on our GSM/GPRS products. Finally, you have also commented on the Bluetooth support on the BlackBerry 7520. We have updated the Bluetooth components of our latest handheld software offering for the Nextel 7520. At the present time Nextel is in the review phase and they will make this software available to customers upon the completion of this review process.

I would like to express our deep gratitude and appreciation for your feedback on our BlackBerry products. It is through this feedback that our customers continue to help us in our efforts to evolve the BlackBerry product to better meet their needs, their likes, and their wishes.

Thank you for using BlackBerry Technical Support,

It speaks well for RIM that you respond on this board. If you check out the Treo boards you'll find very rare input from Palm employees, and only unofficially. Even though I do have the issues alluded to and others - far too low speaker volume on th e7100t and low vol through wired headset incl with unit (I haven't tested a BT headset yet) and distortion when the volume is set to it's rather modest maximum, I'm inclined to try another BB product in the future.
Currently I have the volume issues and the BB desktop software problem. 2 hrs total with T-mo pda support, then escalated to RIM. The tech said she'd tried all available fixes and could do nothing for the 1607 Windows installer error when attempting to install the BB desktop. I have a pretty clean XP install - no games, file sharing etc and the hw is a Thinkpad. I've _never_ had that problem through many installs in several thinkpad over several years.

I just got my 7100 and it looks like I'm now forced to return it, but at least there may be a corrected version out in reasonable time. The desktop software installer needs to be fixed also - that is forcing me, reluctantly, to return it.
Questions for Jnelson: Will the 7100 volume issue require new hardware, or can it be fixed with firmware? The distortion in the handheld speaker (not speakerphone) seems like hardware but perhaps the low vol is not.
Any estimate of a time frame for the fix, and will existing 7100 owners be able to have their units fixed or replaced?
Is RIM aware of the desktop sw problem, and does RIM have a date by which there will be a fix?

thanks

[ajstan99]

Originally Posted by supercrackberry

It speaks well for RIM that you respond on this board.

JNelson - are you a RIM rep, or was this from an e-mail you received from RIM regarding your 7250?

[ajstan99]

This morning, I was finally able to convince a tech at RIM to test and compare the huge drop in Bluetooth headset volume from 3.8 to 4.x. Now that he has been able to reproduce the issue in the lab and hear the difference for himself, he is escalating to engineering and said that he will keep me updated as to progress.

[corey@12mile]

Here's an interesting thought... Bluetooth is a digital in nature. It's kind of just a bit stream that pass's between the headset and the handheld. It's up to the headset to do the conversion to analog and amplify the sound.

I may be wrong, but if I am not mistaken, the volume really shouldn't have anything to do with the handheld, regardless of what brand/model it is...

cd.

[ajstan99]

Originally Posted by corey@12mile

Here's an interesting thought... Bluetooth is a digital in nature. It's kind of just a bit stream that pass's between the headset and the handheld. It's up to the headset to do the conversion to analog and amplify the sound.

I may be wrong, but if I am not mistaken, the volume really shouldn't have anything to do with the handheld, regardless of what brand/model it is...

cd.

Good thought, but the overall volume of a digital representation of a sound wave is a product of its amplitude, just like an analog wave file. The headset is limited in the amount of amplitude (volume) it can add to the audio data it receives from the handset, so, if the 7100 outputs a lower amplitude wave in 4.x than 3.8, then the max volume achieved by headset will be lower as well.

That being said, you may have identified the source of the problem, in which case, it's a REALLY good thought.

[deezmfnutz]

I have a 7100t ran 4.0.0.198 and 4.0.2.32 I have noticed the bluetooth issue ONLY when I have the volume set to MAXIMUM. When the volume is set to max on the handset the earpiece volume is pretty low. HOWEVER, if I turn the volume DOWN (thats right DOWN) 1-3 notches on the headset then the ear piece volume GETS VERY LOUD! Counter-intutive but I keep my handset volume at 2-3 notches RIGHT BELOW MAX and I get GREAT volume on my headset. I have notcied this with both OS revs. However, I will say when the volume is set as described above the sound levels ARE GREAT very loud. FWIW - I am using a cheapo Iomega bluetooth headset and it works like a charm. The only issue I have with bluetooth is that when it is on it seems to REALLY drain my 7100t battery VERY fast. Try the volume thing see if it helps any of you guys.

Salty!

[gregg]

Originally Posted by deezmfnutz

I have a 7100t ran 4.0.0.198 and 4.0.2.32 I have noticed the bluetooth issue ONLY when I have the volume set to MAXIMUM. When the volume is set to max on the handset the earpiece volume is pretty low. HOWEVER, if I turn the volume DOWN (thats right DOWN) 1-3 notches on the headset then the ear piece volume GETS VERY LOUD! Counter-intutive but I keep my handset volume at 2-3 notches RIGHT BELOW MAX and I get GREAT volume on my headset. I have notcied this with both OS revs. However, I will say when the volume is set as described above the sound levels ARE GREAT very loud. FWIW - I am using a cheapo Iomega bluetooth headset and it works like a charm. The only issue I have with bluetooth is that when it is on it seems to REALLY drain my 7100t battery VERY fast. Try the volume thing see if it helps any of you guys.

Salty!

Man I was hopeful but no-go on my 7100g....

[pharma1]

Originally Posted by gregg

Man I was hopeful but no-go on my 7100g....

Did not work on my 7100t. I didn't think it would, but I have gotten to the point where I'll try anything to get usable volume. ;-(

[bbgirl]

hello I have a user with this issue. Is the volume issue, when someone calls and you speak and they can't hear you, or when you call them?

[ajstan99]

Originally Posted by bbgirl

hello I have a user with this issue. Is the volume issue, when someone calls and you speak and they can't hear you, or when you call them?

This is where the you cannot hear the other person very well when using a bluetooth headset. If you are in a quiet office it is serviceable, but it is not loud enough to use in a public place, while driving, or any other place with a relatively small amount of ambient noise.

[Scotty_T]

Originally Posted by ajstan99

This is where the you cannot hear the other person very well when using a bluetooth headset. If you are in a quiet office it is serviceable, but it is not loud enough to use in a public place, while driving, or any other place with a relatively small amount of ambient noise.

ajstan99 - have you gotten anywhere on this yet?

[ajstan99]

Here is what I received from RIM today with permission to share:

"Our Handheld Software version 3.8 for the BlackBerry Wireless Handheld has been found to produce an audio volume, during calls over Bluetooth, that exceeds the intended volume required to adhere to standards that have been set forth for our product. This has been corrected in BlackBerry Handheld Software version 4.0 and later. For this reason, customer may notice a reduction in the volume heard on a Bluetooth device while using the Phone functionality of the BlackBerry after upgrading from version 3.8 the BlackBerry Handheld Software. The current volume over a Bluetooth connection experienced in Handheld Software version 4.0 is under consideration and attempts to increase the volume, while still remaining within the standards, may follow."

From my conversations with RIM support, it appears that the 3.8 volume levels were too high for some headsets, so they adjusted their standard downward in 4.x. Now that the volume is too low for some popular headsets, they are looking at raising the level to achieve a happy medium among differing models. Since I only need to set the volume to just above halfway under 3.8, I'm relatively confident that there is some room to bump the volume to an acceptable level for my HS-810/850 without returning to full 3.8 levels. Here's hoping it happens soon.

For those who can't wait, RIM has also updated (on 7/14) a KB article on supported BT headsets and car kits:

http://www.blackberry.com/knowledgec...58763&vernum=7

Supported headsets are:
Jabra BT250v
Logitech® Mobile Freedom™
Motorola HS820
Plantronics M2500
Plantronics M3000
Sony Ericsson HBH-602