[kurrupt_1]

They can make a BB with a camera just like the Treo 650 gives you the option of buying one with or without the camera feature. Why doesn't RIM do the same thing?

[BBAdmin]

Because:

a) they don't need to, that's what the BlackBerry Connect and BlackBerry Built-In programs are for...let the other handset manufacturers do it

b) they don't want to rattle the cages of those all important corporations, banks and governments that don't want cameras in their BlackBerry's. It will scare them that this is what's to come on all devices.

[JROCK2004]

See I always thought BB where upcoming device to take over the big bad windows/palm but I was wrong. But hey I still like the devices but sometimes that camera or mp3 is missed

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by NJBlackBerry

Which you will lose or will be stolen.

A bad idea...

I don't that's a reason not to have it. Your BB could also be lost or stolen. Let the user be responsible for their own hardware & the use of it.

I don't think removeable memory (in whatever format) would be any more or less vulnerable or secure than the BB itself and I do think it would be a useful addition.

[RIMarkable]

Originally Posted by BBAdmin

Because:

a) they don't need to, that's what the BlackBerry Connect and BlackBerry Built-In programs are for...let the other handset manufacturers do it

b) they don't want to rattle the cages of those all important corporations, banks and governments that don't want cameras in their BlackBerry's. It will scare them that this is what's to come on all devices.

I don't think that RIM decides to or not to add certain features to future devices out of fear of scaring their current customers. That is like GM saying that they won't put leather seats in the H1 Hummer becasue the the military may get confused when buying HumVs.

When there is a widely accepted sercure way to add removable media to a BlackBerry and if the market warrants it, I am sure that we will see it in select future models. 18 months ago we said that there would never be a BlackBerry with Bluetooth. 12 months ago we said that Bluetooth would only be for wireless headsets. 2 months ago Bluetooth was only for head sets and wireless synching. Where will be be 6 months from now?

[kurichan]

Shifting gears, if I understand correctly, my BB is using CPU cycles to scramble the data on my BB? What if speed was more important than security for me? Can I set my BB to not scramble data and run faster? Or is this only when [ Options | Security | Content Protection ] is turned ON?

[jimn367]

I've said it in another thread and I'll say it here.

Absolutely no security department will give an electronic device a free pass because of it's manufacturer. Period. A guard will be required by procudeure to ask: 1) Do you have any cell phones, Media players, laptop computer, or other electronic devices? then 2) Do they have a camera? No security procedure will say If it's a BB then it's a-ok.

An IT department might prefer that BB's never have cameras or removable memory because it will make admin easier, but they are not the only forces in the market. They will not 'walk away' - who are they gonna walk to? As BarJohn has re-written 100 times [lack of camera and removable memory] does not mean they are secure, it only creates the illusion of security.

If my, or any other, bank is making security policy based on one handset manufacturer's installation of CCD's and removable flash RAM then please let me know the banks name so I can move my funds elsewhere. They are clearly clueless.

I suspect RIM hasn't put in cameras because:
1) Their current customer base is not clamoring for it [all of the reasons mentioned about 'security'] and why p!ss off those customers opposed to cameras for no good reason.
2) Their sales are bonkers without those extra features
3) They are probably too busy just trying to roll model upgrades to keep up with demand

If and when their sales slow down they WILL add these features. They are a business that has to grow or die. When (the market of people wanting cameras) > (the fear of losing a couple of customers due to adding cameras) they will be there.

Besides, as I also said in another thread - they [RIM] could come out with a completely different line of devices with no family resemblence under a different product line name. The RIM 'passion fruit' line of lifestyle managers. They could use BB connect, but have features for a completely different market and completely different form factors. This would keep the 'blackberry' line pure.

[jimn367]

For those curious - here is a publicly available brief [that I found doing a google search] on NSA levels of secure computing and data transmission. I found it through a google search. There are no markings on the document, so to the extent of my knowledge it is not sensitive, classified, or ITAR restricted. If anyone discovers differently please notify me and I will immediately remove.

http://isis.poly.edu/courses/cs996-m...yptoPolicy.ppt

[jliborio]

In a way i like the fact that you can store more ringtones, emails ect.. But in my Office we are split between BB's and Tero's and i don't how many times users say they have lost their SD cards. I like the option for more memory, but what about a built memory option "say a GIG" or making a little more secure ( by location), putting it under the battery with the SIM. I just think this is where the market is going but they can do better then the Tero with location of the SD slot.

[RIMarkable]

Originally Posted by NJBlackBerry

Which you will lose or will be stolen.

A bad idea...

I've seen several people reply back with this exact qoute or something similar and I wonder, is SD card theft like a really big problem? If your an IT shop that is really concerned with memory cards being lost or even stolen, why wouldn't you make sure that the devices that you allow to connect to your BES don't have removable memory as an option?

[ahrubik]

Originally Posted by pierre626

I don't agree with you's.With removable memory you could save allsorts of stuff.Important emails,Pictures,Attachment and you could even backup your BB.

Pierre626

This would really be my only reason for wanting this.

[KonTiki]

Originally Posted by ahrubik

This would really be my only reason for wanting this.

I dont see the point you can already to this at the PC level. If you are out of the office or home and PC is not available have a copy of the email forwarded and save it that way it is not such a big problem.

[crosstech100]

Why do you need Removable Memory? What do you need removable memory for? Why can't it just be 2 to 5 gigs of built-in memory?

In my opinion there is no need for removable memory in any device (i.e. digital cameras, video cameras, mp3 players, cell phones, etc). I believe that most people want to removable memory so that they can up grade the size of memory as they please. But what people fail to understand is that most people up grade their memory right off the bat. So, why even deal with removable memory? Just build more memory into the device.

I am just waiting for a company to build a PDA device with 5 to 20 gigs of space of built-in memory!

[morser]

Originally Posted by barjohn

The reality is that people that don't understadn technology often make policy decisions that to a lay person look like they make sense but in reality only create the illusion of security.

Barjohn, The above statement is so correct. It even applys to airport security. If your carryon is searched and, for example, take away a lighter, you can walk into a book store in the secure area and repurchase a lighter. I needed a better example then lighter, but couldn't remember my co-workers true story about what they took away from her.

Anyway, this is an incredibly interesting thread. We are basically talking about the ability to use expanded memory on a Blackberry through an expansion slot, and many comments have been made about trying to secure the data through encryption.
The fact is, Blackberries have unlimited memory. The memory can simply be in the form of a client/server program that a berry stores and retrieves data. With data speeds increasing. RIM WANTS you to use the data network to retrieve and send data. This is what drives the carriers to offer products in the first place; the profit model involving charging for usage.
If the data on the removable memory card will be encrypted and used ONLY on that one blackberry, then the memory card is not necessary, it's kind of redundant. Write a program for the blackberry that stores information on a server, accessible only by that berry. Same thing, and more possible with today's Blackberry features at our fingertips. When are you NOT in coverage these days?
Whether using a memory card, or "online memory", one thing the Berry lacks out of the box, is a navigatable file directory. Dynoplex created their own, and the native picture application stores pictures in a file structure, but there isn't a native one you can navigate. Until there is, using any type of external memory is going to require applications to move the data around.

[barjohn]

The current Blackberry design really doesn't need the memory card capability because applications that could really use it don't exist or the additional hardware capability isn' there. However, for certain applications, like navigation, video, etc. the bandwidth limitations mean that having the files on a remote server are not the best way and would lead to unacceptable performance. Further, having to wait for downloads everytime you want to do something is ok for email but not for larger applications. That is why attachments are a poor experience on the BlackBerry compared to the Pocket PC. To reduce bandwidth demands they turn everything into text and deliver it in small chunks.

The reason that they don't want to put memory cards in is strictly their perception of security as enforced by the U.S. Government. You would then have a memory card you could take out and use to store information from a computer you shouldn't take data from and bring carry it out. The problem as I see it is that while I can't take my BlackBerry into certain spaces, nothing prevents me from carrying memory stick devices in other than my promise not to connect anything to the computers I am not supposed to connect memory devices to. For example, iPods are banned on our base but USB memory sticks and micro drives are not. Does that make sense? I can walk into classified spaces with memory sticks but not with a cellphone and the spaces are RF shielded so the phones wouldn't work anyway. Does this make sense?

When rules don't make sense people tend to ignore them. It is poor policy to create rules that people can't understand or make sense of and then expect them to follow the policy.

[moonbaseone]

Originally Posted by Inphektion

Rim just needs to split its product line in the future for "secure" devices and "non-secure". So there could be an 8700cS that doesn't have removable memory and no camera and then there could be an 8700cN that has the SD card slot and full BT profiles and digital camera built in.

This is the only way they can really do it. Because it isn't just about the security of the data on the removable media card, but gov building don't want devices that take those cards inside cause its then easier to steal or compromise data from another system. Same reason they don't want cameras. So gov employees who work there simply wouldn't be allowed to own such devices. I understand this and it bothers me when I read a review of the 8700c and the guy mentions that an obvious shortcoming of it is no camera built in. Many enterprises don't want their employees carrying around a phone that can snap photos so it isn't a shortcoming.

The solution is to continue developing and improving things on the handheld without these features but also make a model that includes these features to hit the home/small office or not as security conscious market.

I agree 100% That would be a good way to go. give both sides what they want.

I understand the business users that dont want a camera or a music media software or expandable on their BBs, but what about those that do?

Nextel use to be strickly business, then a few years ago they realized that people wanted all the toys so they started trying to cater to them too.

I am sure Rim will do the same and start adding all the "toys' to their units.

Me, I don't care for a camera on my cell untill they become 3.0 mega pixels.

[Jagga]

Originally Posted by Mark Rejhon

Remember... Memory cards are NOT necessarily insecure temporary removable cards that can be plugged into a card reader. There is already a "upgradeable semipermanent memory module format" called RS-MMC and MicroSD for cellphones -- these should essentially really be considered memory upgrades rather than memory cards.

This is the ORIGINAL purpose of T-Flash cards (then shortly after the moniker for TransFlash then MicroSD came there after Motorola took on it in a BIG way as removable storage.

Just to correct you removable memory, whether in a regular phone or in a smartphone has YET to be used as a buffer to increase on board memory; storage file locations are always different. But in a BB it CAN be used this way.

I've been preaching this for months, even EONS ago and everyone bit my head off.... only now do you all see its feature set.