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Old 08-06-2009, 09:53 PM   #21
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True, tort reform causes the costs of lawsuits to go up, but I have no sympathy for an automobile company paying through the nose because it knowingly let a problem go and then causes a car to explode that kills a family. If you limit the monetary amount that a company can be sued for, that allows them to cut more corners and say "F--- it", the cost of a lawsuit because of death will be cheaper than fixing a problem. It happens.
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Old 08-07-2009, 06:02 AM   #22
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that same argument works for Insurance companies everyday. Higher profits = less care for customers.
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Old 08-07-2009, 07:49 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by test54 View Post
I agree tort reform is needed but so is health care reform. The democrats might be in the way of tort reform because of unions & lawyers but the republicans stand in the way of health care reform because of the lobbying from the high $$ insurance companies. Both are corrupt at this point, its pick your poison.
I usually try and stay out of these type debates in a public forums simply because I have enough "real life" to deal with. However, I had to speak up on this.

Simply put, that is wrong information. Latest trends simply do not support the belief of some people that the Republicans are bought and paid for by the health care industry, or even the insurance companies. In fact, it's quite the opposite.

According to OpenSecrets.org, it's actually the opposite in recent years. If you'd have made this statement in 2006 or 2007, I'd probably agree. But not in recent years. If you go on their site, you can simply follow the money (I'm not affiliated with the site-I simply googled some information to find out). Here is what they are reporting:

In their Influence and Lobbying section, they include 2008 donations and 2010 trends.

Health Professionals:

2010: 59% Dem 41% Rep.
2008: 52% Dem 47% Rep

Insurance:

2010: 55% Dem 45% Rep
2008: 45% Dem 55% Rep

Pharmaceuticals:

2010: 55% Dem 45% Rep
2008: 50% Dem 50% Rep

Now let's compare that with lawyers/law firms:

2010: 84% Dem 16% Rep
2008 76% Dem 23% Rep

Sorry, but the numbers just don't back up what you're trying to say in reference to the Republicans being bought and paid for by the health care industry. Tort reform is another story with Democrats.

Side note: I don't intend my views to come across as pro-Republican. Personally, I find it very hard to tell the difference anymore; they're all crooks and just out for power and greed. Once people figure out that there's very little difference between the aisles, then maybe they'll start voting people in who'll actually do the work of The People instead of for the "party" or themselves, no matter which side of the aisle they sit on. However I'm sure I won't see that in my life time, since neither party as exclusive rights to sheep.

With that said, I'm back to lurking in this forum.....
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Old 08-07-2009, 08:17 AM   #24
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Thanks for that Clubchucker - trends do always change and I agree that both sides look more and more alike in their greed and corruption.

Both tort and health care need major reform.
To me health care reform is essential to the US being able to compete both culturally & economically in the future.

Scathing attack on the Rep., probably a little far out but I can see his points.
washingtonpost.com
"Can there be anyone more two-faced than the Republican leaders who in one breath rail against the evils of government-run health care and in another propose a government-subsidized high-risk pool for people with chronic illness, government-subsidized community health centers for the uninsured, and opening up Medicare to people at age 55?"
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Old 08-07-2009, 09:02 AM   #25
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How about Obama and Chris Dodd taking more money than anyone else from Fannie and Freddie to keep the regulations at bay, and then turn to the masses (who are asses) and tell them (those people who think they are pro-regulation and thats why they are voting Obama) that McCain was the reason for the banking fiasco. That's twofaced. He decided, when he started running for President, that he was pro-regulation. Or maybe it was then that he discovered what it meant. The Washington Post is as far left as the Washington Times is right.
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Old 08-08-2009, 11:35 AM   #26
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Sarah Palin sure has an opinion.

CNN Political Ticker: All politics, all the time Blog Archive - Palin: Obama’s ‘death panel’ would decide Trig’s care « - Blogs from CNN.com
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Old 08-08-2009, 01:41 PM   #27
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Well she will believe anything out there, there are all kinds of GOP rumors being spread and I'm sure she believes all of them...
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Old 08-08-2009, 03:44 PM   #28
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Well she will believe anything out there, there are all kinds of GOP rumors being spread and I'm sure she believes all of them...
Buahahahahahaha

And you've drank the koolaid from Obama.

Enjoy having the likes of IRS agents make YOUR decision of whether you get healthcare and/or live or die.
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Old 08-08-2009, 04:47 PM   #29
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my fishing has pulled in the big one...thanks. Like always, the best path is in the middle.

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Including the head-politician-in-charge, The President.

His health care bill end life in America as you know it today. Well, what is left of America as we knew it this past January 20.
- I'll always have this quote. Talk about koolaid.
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Old 08-08-2009, 05:00 PM   #30
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It's koolaid either way, whether your fruiti tootie , or my plane-jane grape. It's koolaid.

Say goodbye to another freedom you used to have.

How about spending some actual time reading the healthcare bill and what all it will allow the government to further rule in your life.

Last edited by JSanders; 08-08-2009 at 05:02 PM..
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Old 08-09-2009, 04:50 AM   #31
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Say good by e to your loved ones who are sick. Obama wants to make sure they depart early. As a women I am glad I have the choice on abortion but I would never let a baby that has come into the world die because it was sick and going to cost to much money. Better hope you dont get cancer or you will be out of luck there too
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Old 08-09-2009, 12:57 PM   #32
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Say good by e to your loved ones who are sick. Obama wants to make sure they depart early.

Yay! yet another person believing the rumors....I guess Palin is not the only one. Maybe ignorance is bliss.....
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Old 08-09-2009, 10:36 PM   #33
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Whatever ends up in the bill, it is the height of arrogance existing in D.C. that they feel free to take Medicare funds and use them for the new program. Anyone working at a private company that did that would go to jail. At least with Social Security they "borrow" by leaving Treasury securities with the SS administration. Now they're just going to be confiscating money intended for post-retirement medical care and spending it on someone else's current medical care.

Medicare is going bankrupt. And somehow, without rationing, those funds are both going to be able to cover Medicare obligations and significantly fund an entire new program. That's ridiculous on the face of it.

There's no magic that will stretch dollars from a program that is going bankrupt to cover both that program and half of a new one. Rationing is in the cards whatever anyone says. If not, the tax increases would have to be enormous to keep both programs solvent.
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Old 08-10-2009, 06:17 AM   #34
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the spread of these rumors is really amazing. kudos to the GOP & lobbyists.
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Old 08-10-2009, 06:36 AM   #35
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the spread of these rumors is really amazing. kudos to the GOP & lobbyists.
Sad that you can't say anything more than that written in the Obama playbook.

You actually think this bill is good? What is good about it?
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Old 08-10-2009, 08:03 AM   #36
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You actually think this bill is good? What is good about it?
I don't think there's anything good about this bill. I don't drink the Obama Kool-aid, nor do I believe he wants to kill our loved ones off early. I just think this bill is a terrible idea and I hope it never gets passed.
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Old 08-10-2009, 08:20 AM   #37
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I'm not generally a fan of government intervention into the lives of the people, but I believe some form of national health insurance makes good sense. In the case of health care, unlike most other areas that fall under the "pursuit of happiness" umbrella, the people who have the most problems are generally the least able to go do something for themselves to change the situation.

As an illustration of how things can go right, here's an article about how VA has done a lot of things right in managed care:

How Veterans' Hospitals Became the Best in Health Care - TIME
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Old 08-10-2009, 09:02 AM   #38
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Yay! yet another person believing the rumors....I guess Palin is not the only one. Maybe ignorance is bliss.....
Rumors? These are facts. Just because you believe everything that comes out of the mouth of your savior Obama. I am not a republican or a democrat. I am a free thinker. I actually voted for Obama but I now regret it.
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Old 08-10-2009, 09:53 AM   #39
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Ok so allowing Dr. to be compensated for counseling patients every 5 years about how they wish their last years to go is suddenly a "death panel"? sounds stupid, more talk about people's final years not only saves money but it relieves stress on both the patient and the family.

People are being lead to believe that this somehow will kill off their employer based benefit - rumor. However to compete overseas we cannot continue to lean on employers to provide it, simple business research will tell you that.
Seniors are lead to believe that this will negatively affect their medicare - rumor.

Honestly there is just a ton of fear mongering going on with this. People using phrases like death panel, "end life as we know it", "illegals will get healthcare plans", abortions will be "inlcuded in the govt. healthcare plan", "people will be allowed to die if their treatment cost more than $22,000" -- All of which are not true.

Get the facts about the stability and security you get from health insurance reform | Health Insurance Reform Reality Check
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Old 08-10-2009, 10:13 AM   #40
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The link you posted is part of the Obama food chain no thanks. Keep drinking the kool aide. Ill pass Im certainly glad my children and husband is healthy. Weve seen what they are doing with the Auto industry and banking industry, do you really want them involved in health care?
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