[Klotar]

I finally read elsewhere, the first reason that makes sense to me as to why software vendors/authors of major GPS applications are going the route of server-based navigation software instead of SD-storage based maps where the client does not use data services...

Software piracy.

It had not occurred to me. I guess if GPS stand-alone applications were written, they can then be "cracked" (e.g. if they use an activation key or whatnot) and then downloaded from torrent sites and used by anyone.

While I don't like using data over using maps stored on an SD card, and even though I still lean towards the " dems munny-grubbin' varmints" theory, this, at least makes sense and I can understand.

[thomasdl62]

Originally Posted by CanuckBB

But 4GB cards are still hard to find. 2 and 6 are all over the place. I fing it hard to order something like a 4GB card from an online vendor where the shipping will be almost as much as the card. Hopefuly, 8GB cards will be widely available by the time 4.3 rolls around.

4GB sandisk microSD on Ebay. Paid 20.00 with shipping.

[DataCentre]

I just saw an 8GB Micro on eBay for $45, and would you believe that the seller was charging $30 for shipping. Sheesh. I mean....buy a bubble picture mailer...only cost about $2, and what's shipping for something that small....$1.50 - $2.50 max. Haha.

[wu-wei]

Originally Posted by Klotar

I finally read elsewhere, the first reason that makes sense to me as to why software vendors/authors of major GPS applications are going the route of server-based navigation software instead of SD-storage based maps where the client does not use data services...

Software piracy.

It had not occurred to me. I guess if GPS stand-alone applications were written, they can then be "cracked" (e.g. if they use an activation key or whatnot) and then downloaded from torrent sites and used by anyone.

While I don't like using data over using maps stored on an SD card, and even though I still lean towards the " dems munny-grubbin' varmints" theory, this, at least makes sense and I can understand.

That makes sense for Palm and Windows Mobile platforms, but is not an issue on the BlackBerry platform where devices are uniquely identified by PIN.

And a software developer with any sort of grasp on reality has to anticipate a certain percentage of loss through piracy, though all strive to minimize that number as much as possible (read Windows Genuine Advantage, etc.).

[tazeat]

Unfortunately (or fortunately depending on your end of the stick), it is VERY hard to reverse engineer BlackBerry applications at this time, learning from other applications, and getting around trials, creating keygens and what not are near impossible. So while the maps may be fair game as they are on the memory card, the actual software itself would probably be just fine authenticating the PIN number. Although I would anticipate they allow offline activation since this would be perfect for those who have a BlackBerry without data.

[SPembleton]

And SD-based Mapping programs, such as Street Atlas USA, are prevalent in WM5. I am already regretting that my company forced me to change to a Blackberry from a Treo.

[Mark Rejhon]

Originally Posted by Jagga

Hello Mark,

Is there a BB specific API that will allow what you're trying to accomplish listed here?

RIM Device Java Library

Thanks.

Easy, if you're the company that owns source code to the GPS software. This assumes OS 4.2 and later devices, but all 8XXX devices (even old 8700) can be upgraded to OS 4.2.

net.rim.device.api.io.file
RIM Device Java Library: Package net.rim.device.api.io.file

javax.microedition.io.file
RIM Device Java Library: Package javax.microedition.io.file

FileConnection
RIM Device Java Library: Interface FileConnection

Specifically, FileConnection can be used in lieu of HttpConnection -- have a big database of map on the SD card (i.e. an encrypted version of what's stored on the web server -- just stored on the SD card instead). Encrypt them if desired, to the BlackBerry PIN, and the piracy problem is solved. Can even be made much more secure than Windows Mobile, it just have to be secured in a different way than it is on Windows Mobile. Yes, maybe an Internet connection to authenticate the permission to access GPS maps -- but that's easy, when implemented properly. There are Stream object's that allow files to be read like an HTTP stream, one could even use the same map database format, if they wished.

Modern BlackBerry units have a filesystem, complete with folder structure, files and all -- it's not yesterday's BlackBerry where RIM prevented you from being able to operate a filesystem complete with gigabytes worth of files that you can read/write.

Tsk, tsk. GPS companies still haven't caught on. I'm still waiting!

[st@cey]

Originally Posted by Mark Rejhon

Rove Mobile File Manager from www.rove.com is a third-party "File Explorer" for BlackBerry memory cards, is living proof that third-party applications can read & write to memory cards.

Link correction...rovemobile.com

Link: Rove Mobile - Network Administration and Remote Access

;)

[Mark Rejhon]

Originally Posted by st@cey

Link correction...rovemobile.com

Fixed.

[jorgeledesmadds]

wow this would be so cool, I'm currently paying $5 a month to Mapquest and I'm pretty happy but I'd rather use the SD version of the Maps, you're always connected regardless of coverage is this correct, if so, this would rock.

[jorgeledesmadds]

Is this how Nokia Maps 2.0 works, download maps and then use the A-Gps to fix your position and track

[ryanish]

Waiting to see what is being done ... this would be a great program!

[MBW]

I'm going to disagree.

I'm a reporter to reporters, and in that role, I've recently reviewed AT&T Navigator (aka TeleNav 5.5), MapQuest Navigator, Garmin Mobile and several other offerings. With the single possible exception of display size, I think these BB navigators outperform dashboard units.

And a fundamental reason for that is that they don't deal with static maps.

Each one gets up-to-the-minute server-based maps for the entire planned trip corridor when travel begins, so the maps are in the handset regardless of whether or not there's any cell signal. Each one updates regularly to fetch new info about road conditions, traffic jams, etc. And the scheme is extremely reasonable in terms of a conservative amount of total data traffic making everything happen.

I also tried VZ Navigator when it was new and I hated it. With it, lose a signal and you'd lose your way. Track your path and you can't make or take calls. And there were 4-5 ways they upped your bill for using it.

This is not to undermine the importance of your discovery of these programming options - only to address that I strongly believe that stored maps are ultimately a less than optimal choice for navigation.

[windybaseball]

Well, static map option may be less than optimal, but still way better than the proclaimed "map over the air".

The whole idea of GPS is really know where you are "anytime", "anywhere". It's not "anytime IF within cell network".

Even though the routing information is cached locally, as you suggested, but what if you are way off route and out of the cached area ? What if in the middle of no where you want to look for gas station ? Be prepared.

Another reality, even though unpleasant, those map servers never update daily, in fact they only update map data according to prefixed time schedule, mostly monthly basis. So, go figure.

Originally Posted by MBW

I'm going to disagree.

I'm a reporter to reporters, and in that role, I've recently reviewed AT&T Navigator (aka TeleNav 5.5), MapQuest Navigator, Garmin Mobile and several other offerings. With the single possible exception of display size, I think these BB navigators outperform dashboard units.

And a fundamental reason for that is that they don't deal with static maps.

Each one gets up-to-the-minute server-based maps for the entire planned trip corridor when travel begins, so the maps are in the handset regardless of whether or not there's any cell signal. Each one updates regularly to fetch new info about road conditions, traffic jams, etc. And the scheme is extremely reasonable in terms of a conservative amount of total data traffic making everything happen.

I also tried VZ Navigator when it was new and I hated it. With it, lose a signal and you'd lose your way. Track your path and you can't make or take calls. And there were 4-5 ways they upped your bill for using it.

This is not to undermine the importance of your discovery of these programming options - only to address that I strongly believe that stored maps are ultimately a less than optimal choice for navigation.

[HuwSy]

as many have said, static maps arent as good as live maps (when actually live, but teleatlas havent updated some of there city maps of manchester in over a year so one ways are a danger as theyv all changed since) but im usually using sat nav once im already lost and in the middle of nowhere which usually means no signal to retreive a route.
hopefully someone can make a nice hybrid that will detect, or have the option to select, which type of live/static mapping is appropriate. until then im stickin with tomtom.

[webberry]

Originally Posted by MBW

I'm going to disagree.



And a fundamental reason for that is that they don't deal with static maps.

Each one gets up-to-the-minute server-based maps for the entire

False. Neither the maps, nor the POIs on these services such as Telenav are "up to the minute" and often not even up to the year or the last 2 years. The maps are on their servers, but they choose to not update them very often. There is alot of very out of date data stored on their servers. I tried it and it was very annoying to have to frequently use other methods (such as Goog411) to find addresses not in their "live, up to the minute" database.
Some of these same addresses missing from TeleNav were in the year-old static Garmin maps.

The other major failings of Telenav-like services is not being able to start using them when you are not in the cell coverage area and some of them will drop the routing if you need to take or make a phone call.
Nasty experience.

[mtc1968]

I live in italy and recently I bought a BB 8310. I have vodafone that offer for 20 euros/month the GPS program. Really I often fly to other european country and in that countries using an internet connection could be extremely expensive (1,6$/min + something for each Kb downloaded). So if someone of you can help me to find a local based GPS program I'll be extremely happy. 1 month ago I read something about a Telenav off-line product; do you have news?
Thanks a lot and best regards
matteo

[FF2]

Trekbuddy and Mobile Gmaps can both be used without data. But you have to first use other programs to create maps on the web, download them to your computer and then copy them to an SD card. They can be a bit hard to setup but do work.

[HuwSy]

oh. does either do route planning with directions on the downloaded maps?

[FF2]

I don't believe so but I've never looked for that feature. Since their maps are merely graphic information, they probably do not contain the kind of data needed to create routes.